I like this proposal. I think there is real need for some kind of action function here on ned. Perhaps it could replace or run alongside the polls function that appears never to have been used.

But one thing I don't get is the "Five Minute" part.

Don't Nedsters have a longer attention span?

Good question David, and yes I think we do. The "Five Minute" part connects to a framework Mark had developed earlier, that I thought if we started from, might have some traction. Let's say, that's a "minimum investment." The entry level action.

I really like it Lars! Totally doable, (just need the time.)

What are some examples of more complex actions? Making donations and signing petitions are good examples, but they're very simple. These will be really easy for people to do, and will help Ned.com start to have a bigger impact on the world... But what if we grouped a bunch of 5 minute actions as steps on the to-do list of a larger task?

So here's an example that I've been thinking of... What if a heated discussion was going on, and someone made a claim that was hard to believe. A new action might be to find some (independent) supporting evidence for that claim. The difference is that it's an effort that only has to be done by one or a few people, and then it's marked as done, and would need to show up inline with the discussion that led to the request for action.

Some actions are well served by starting a new discussion on Ned. The click for Kireka or Ned team on Kiva are good recent examples of this. But what if we could launch a coordinated effort that actually could result in something more complex like what is described in "Developing a Maker Faire for Africa." What's missing in the discussion format is any overview of what has already been accomplished (without reading the whole discussion.)

I'm feeling a little entrepreneurial spirit these days, and want to create a web site for my town of Hinesburg Vermont, where face to face activities like green-up day could be coordinated on the site. We would have the to-do list: buy garbage bags, get the word out, assign people evenly to different areas, see if any local businesses would offer a donation of coffee and maybe snacks, print out the status and post it on the bulletin board for people who don't spend as much time on the web. Each one of these tasks is something that anyone could do in the town, if they had a way of selecting the task, then letting others known when it's done. Anyone could see what remains to be done at any time, and most importantly, everyone would be 'in the loop' on the effort.

The simpler actions are definitely worth implementing sooner... I'd hate to see the more ambitious goals keeping the simpler things from happening, but for me the more ambitious project tracking might eventually be lucrative... which helps me justify the development time.

Jim wrote:

But what if we grouped a bunch of 5 minute actions as steps on the to-do list of a larger task?

Right on, kind of like a "modular" series of custom actions that can be "stacked" - either from the get-go (the "path" version) or as the discussion, group, whatever evolves (the "emergent" version?). Am I hearing right?

You also raise the great "coordinated action" point. In a sense, a series of actions taking place at the same time that radiate outward from a specific cause. For example, for Green Up Day, a series of publicity actions might need to take place that people could chomp off, etc.

I like it!

So why limit it to "Five Minutes" as David points out: be able to enlarge the utility as people need it.

Be interesting to think about how to make the actions that emerge and take place within a discussion visible. For example, there could be an "actions" header at the beginning of discussions - say, between "Comments" and "Viewed" and a clickable number which takes the user to a list of actions by name/type etc. and includes a backlink to the source of the action in a thread or to the action/resolution itself...?

Anyway, glad the timing is in step with your spirit, Jim! Let me know how we can help, if it emerges that this is worth pursuing. Maybe our first "action" can be to raise some modest developer funds so its not coming out of hide...?

>>Maybe our first "action" can be to raise some modest developer funds so its not coming out of hide...?<<

I'll make a pledge, Lars you want to put up a Chip-In widget for this?

I don't know - what's the process for figuring this out, whether its a go, Jim has enough to work off of as an idea, etc? I haven't heard you chime in, though I know we chatted about it briefly...

Did I mention it would be cool to have a global "actions" rss feed?

Happy to set up the ChipIn if we've got some kind of agreement to do this, or something akin to it.

Follow this link to make a pledge! http://www.fundable.com/groupact ions/groupaction.2008-09-14.5871 582088

Very much enjoy many of the ideas as they are outlined above. I think meaningful things that make real actions towards supporting others ideas, projects and businesses could be a very powerful thing.

The idea with Five Minute Action Network is a combination of quick actions almost anyone can take and collectively make a difference, make the world a better place: http://www.ned.com/group/fman/ws /index/ The reason behind Five Minute Action was as an introduction to people wanting to make a difference, but kind of a quick "gateway" experience into what might then be a deeper involvement. In some ways, FMAN is conceived of as the action component of a Kiva, 5 minutes you're in and in some small way have made the world a better place.

Setting that aside, I think if the Ned "action" tab becomes a way for groups and people to help take action to help a person or organization complete some measurable and meaningful things, that could become pretty interesting.

Other thoughts on actions:

Is there a need for estimated time for a person to complete the action?

Perhaps some form of (for sake of a better word) reporting. Written, photo, video? Lesson(s) learned? What worked, what didn’t and why?

Writing the expected or measurable outcome as determined by the action creator upon starting the action.

Would there be a need to filter or limit amount of overall total actions so a wasteland of uncompleted actions is not generated?

Should a member have either completed a certain amount of actions, or achieved some timeline milestone (point level?) before they can start posting their own actions?

You say: Time sensitive ie beginning and end dates, but perhaps all actions have some expiration date of 30 days or under?

How can it be as robust as it can while being as simple as possible?

The two primary "currency units" seem like they are time and money. Time in doing something either online or real world or money towards something.

Also, perhaps each member has an action (offer/want) that they have under their personal profile. 140 characters for each personal profile action have/want:

• Have: 30 minute phone consultation for web site review
• Want: Someone to design a small shipping/packaging flyer.

Other ideas?

edit: format

Hey, there's $300 towards the $1,000 goal...nice start.

In some ways this is part of the challenge, how to get these action based things in front of people that might be interested...while not overwhelming with too many things.

Up to 300-400 visitors a day to Ned, and 10 people have seen this thread.

With regards to "actions" here are the 99 top actions for the initial alpha period of the play if forward web site/game Akoha. And, after over a year, and being featured as a main tab at Razoo, here is the entire list of 859 actions listed under their Take Action tab, listed in order of Most Popular.

hm, those look a bit different than how i imagined the 5-minute action tool working on ned, but hey, if that's where people's attention is at, that's cool too i guess. maybe that's why stuff like twitter works - people put a lot of emphasis on what seems a bit like navel gazing these days. Top ten are:

1. Help a Startup in Need
2. Invite Someone for Coffee
3. Give Someone a Book
4. Wild Mission Card
5. Give Someone a Surprise Gift
6. Give Someone Flowers
7. Donate an Hour of Your Time
8. Invite Someone for Drinks
9. Thank Someone
10. Send Drinks to a Couple in Love

Is this for real? On the one hand, isn't most of this what we call social behavior? In making it so visible, as some kind of important "action," what are we really saying about ourselves...?

Both these lists show that coming up with general good things to do has it's challenges. Too general, too local, too unclear, no overall collective result that would leave someone feel like they did anything that was really meaningful or had much of an impact.

I strongly suspect we can cook up something more interesting.

Mark Grimes said:

I strongly suspect we can cook up something more interesting.

I absolutely agree!!

I like the "haves" and "wants" idea, also the overall concept. I think there's definitely a need for a central point to hang cause-related actions around. I'm sure I for one would find it useful (and reassuring!).

Ceris wrote:

I think there's definitely a need for a central point to hang cause-related actions around.

Indeed, and I hope that they can largely be "causes" that arise within ned and have concrete outcomes. The "niceness noise" is crowding out attention for worthwhile, roll up the sleeves opportunities...

I've got an idea ... albeit a recycled one from my dream of a peacetiles educational legacy. (and you could still do that sometime down the track Lars)

Here 'tis - and I'll start smallish and do-able.

Pick one kid and pay for that kid's education - semester by semester, year by year ..... a full-on commitment to changing the world through education starting with one kid.

"The Girl Effect" .....>>>> the Ned Effect. Our Ned Kid :)

And I'm bawling again ..... this video gets to me in the most wonderful way EVERYTIME I see it. Brilliant!

Small and doable I like :) Although for the sake of equality shouldn't such a scheme involve a boy as well? (I have read up on the logic over financing girls in preference to boys, but still...) One more plea from me, should such a scheme get off the ground, could we ensure the method chosen for transactions allows for very small (though regular) donations, so that the kinds of donations I would be able to make were not swallowed up in bank and payment processing charges?

G'Day Ceris - yep - agreed on all things small and doable.

On the "equality" ideal, I got a text from another Neddie (incidentally, what term are we using these days?? Nedster, Ned-head??) to the same effect as your question/suggestion.

All I can do is chip in my .02 on this - and curse O-Net for not having an accesible archive for me to cut and paste posts from last year .... because I know I wrote a goodie at some point!! :)

For me, the notion of equality is terribly subjective. In most Western nations, equal gender opportunity for access to education, health care, law enforcement and many other services/opportunities is almost taken for granted so the idea of "equality" - or at least "our" idea of it - is very different from the reality of many developing nations.

I'll play devil's advocate.

How many female children would we have to educate to bring gender equality up to scratch if the kids lived in India? 2:1 maybe.

What about Pakistan? 5:1 perhaps? Or Afganistan? 20:1? Or would it be more like 50:1? Not sure but there is nothing that resembles a European concept of equality in any developing country that I've ever been in.

Of course the delicious irony of all this is that here in Melbourne, I will not join "Emily's List" (a faction of the Labor Party) because it only allows female members of the ALP to join - and excluding the blokes really pisses me off. It is inequitable!!! :)

Hopefully that roughly explains how I feel about the idea of equality and it's shifting & diverse regional meaning and reality. It's why the Girl Effect video gets to me every time ..... oh that part about being accepted by the tribal elders always makes me teary. It is so powerful.

On the regular and small donations/contributions set-up & fee-induced money-munching - I agree totally!!!!!

I guess first things first though..... it was only a suggestion and it might not be seen as realistic by the others at this point in time.

And where is everyone else??? :)

gayle, great video - thanks for sharing! and i agree, no reason why an action tool here at ned.com couldn't be used to create and promote exactly such an action - semester by semester, year by year.

i've been working with and donating to a group in uganda that does a super job of helping youths there secure an education. its called lead (its morphed a few times, each turn gaining slightly better traction. its now led by LiA's former Monica Nankoma!).

Anyway, you can learn more here: http://www.leaduganda.org/about. html

They enroll both boys and girls, though not certain about the ratios.

Hey - I'm just about to fly out the door so I thought I'd better stick my head in briefly.

Lars - that video was a Mark find.... he put the link up a while back (possibly on that dreadful twitter :) and I was instantly hooked by the simplicity (and power) of it.

I'll have a look at the uganda link - ta!

Please don't get me wrong on the ratio/boy-girl thing. It was just me putting my thoughts up about how one word - equality - can mean such a different thing depending upon where you live and what your experiences are. (and the flow on from that)

NOW .... it would take A LOT more interest than just a posie from Mark, a lovely post by Ceris and the same from you for me to even consider constructing the framework for something as significant as a committment to a child's education.

And Lars, when you put this thread up, what did you actually have in mind???

And where is everyone?? (Meron is away this weekend I know that much)

Are there any other thoughts/ideas??

Right - whoosh..... on my broomstick and off!! :)

G'Day to you Gayle !

I do see your point about redressing the balance, I just have a hard time with exclusion agendas. But then I've never been in a developing country ! Anyways, I'm not going to make an issue of it ;)

I for one like your suggestion, and I for two would like to know what others think!

Lars, Lead Uganda looks great, I wonder if they might be able to help some of the KJT kids? I'll pass it on, cheers :)

"Exclusion agendas"!!!

I read this an hour ago and - after breathing into a paper bag for a while - put my reaction down to a very long day and not enough food.

I'm now showered and fed .... and am reaching for a fresh paper bag.

Hmmmmm.

<edit: removed what I did today - it's irrelevant.>

Whoops, it wasn't meant to offend, just a bad choice of words, it was past my bedtime and I was trying to be succinct but instead I put my foot in my mouth ... sorry Gayle, I hope you're breathing better now!

Gail with fresh violets in her hair and light of head wrote:

Lars, when you put this thread up, what did you actually have in mind???

I didn't have anything specific in mind in terms of a project - just the notion of a simple tool to improve the ned. i was hoping that through discussion we might flesh out some of the features that would make it really useful for a range of users here, since I know we all operate at different levels, at different times of day.

So we kind of have a range fingered already, from "hug a penguin" styled self-infatuation stuff to meaningful, long-term "send a girl to school" actions.

Which raises the issue of timescale for actions - "five minutes on up"? From a single 'click' to a series of deepening relationships...

That said, I'd love to use such a tool for peace tiles and ad hoc actions...

Thanks Ceris - it's cool. :)